Love is something that should be celebrated. Marriage is a good way to share your hapiness with others.

Arnon, you simply don't know where you are talking about.

Amita

There are two possibilities: you have never been to a wedding, or you have never noticed what’s actually going on there.
And to avoid misunderstandings: I don’t blame people for getting married, I don’t think getting married is a criminal act -- I’m not a crusader against marriage.
You want to get married and celebrate, and share your love with other people for ten thousands of dollars or in case if you are poor or stingy or both for thousands of dollars, fine, go ahead. Make my day.
The last time I heard people speaking about sharing love with other people I thought they were trying to convert a few Indians to Christianity, or they were inviting forty youngsters to a swingers club – now I know that there is a third possibility. Some couples want to convince their friends, colleagues and other people that they love each other because they don’t believe it themselves.
Are you married? Yes? I bless you. If not I give you one year to get married otherwise your comments won't be accepted on this site anymore.
And please don't try to convert other people because you yourself turned marriage into your personal God, and love into your personal teddy bear.

converting

Arnon, you react quite childish when people disagree with you. Amita is just defending people's decision to get married. You are the one trying to convert people.

Amita, don't take his respons personally. If you want to get married, I am your man !.

Quod erat demonstrandum

Hoover

At my cousin's wedding there was a Norwegian guy named Hovard, but everybody called him Hoover. I was told he sometimes disappeared in the woods around Alta (near Hammerfest) for a week or two, only with a guitar and a backsack filled with sausages.
I asked him to be my best man if I was ever going to marry. He promised me to show up.

Arnon, I agree with you. I always feel pitty when I see a bride in white and her broom on the most happy day of their live. And weddings are nothing more than a boring way to spend money.

Amita & Gerard

The arrogance that people who don’t believe in the necessity of getting married don’t know what they are talking about is not to be tolerated.
As is the remark that the one who notices this arrogance is behaving childish -- this is not a valid argument, this is just another adjective. As you might have noticed I invite people to disagree with me, but I don’t think this site should become a forum for missionaries. As to my remark that our Amita should get married within a year or risk getting her comments erased on this site, well my dear Gerard do you really think that I will force Amita to proof that she is married before May 27, 2008? You have a vivid fantasy or your mother just gave you a cuff on the ears because once again you spilled your tea on the carpet. The second possibility is the most plausible.
Anyhow I hope our Amita is already happily married, if not I’m sure that her future husband will be happy to have you Gerard as her best man. If her husband doesn’t want you as best man, maybe you can marry Amita.
Amita, please send your picture to Johannes (Johannes@arnongrunberg.com.) Inform him what’s your monthly income after taxes, if you have ever been arrested, if you have ever been or still are patient in a mental hospital. and if you play tennis and/or golf. Please add some information about cooking skills. With your picture and this information we will look for your future husband and we will find him. Unless my dear Amita you settle for Gerard, which is of course highly unlikely. Even a woman like Amita can do better. (Don’t take this personal, Gerard, your time will come. If I’m not mistaken around September 2028.)

Amita, sorry for being a stickler, but you're wrong.

What you're saying is that Arnon is wrong about marriage because he's not married. That's false. To demonstrate, I can easily turn your argument around: because you're married, your opinion on not being married is false. You simply don't know what you're talking about. How do you like that?

Again, QED.

Dont misunderstand me, I believe you and wish you (and Herman Hartmann?) all the best.

Amita, sorry for being a stickler, but you're wrong.

What you're saying is that Arnon is wrong about marriage because he's not married. That's false. To demonstrate, I can easily turn your argument around: because you're married, your opinion on not being married is false. You simply don't know what you're talking about. How do you like that?

Again, QED.

Dont misunderstand me, I believe you and wish you (and Herman Hartmann?) all the best.

As I said here before, the best man is the bachelor, and I won’t say it twice.
Arnon, are you cheating? Does that second glass not belong to the extraterrestrial?
It is OK, I too prefer extraterrestrials; sometimes we share happiness, most time we share common melancholy.

@Amita
“You simply do not know what you are talking about”, that is exactly what religious people so often state as an argument. Mostly they mean: you should not talk about it & I forbid you to talk about it.
But maybe you have a point, as the Chinese say ‘De gustibus non’.
Kind greetings.

Arnon: if you like extraterrestials, then you'll like this: a friend of mine is writing sardonic play called 'The Playpit'. A bunch of bored parents (mainly mothers) gather around a playpit, discuss whatever it is mothers discuss and drink rozé. When suddenly a UFO lands in the middle of the playpit. An extraterrestial demands that one child be sacrficied or else all married grown ups die, and the single moms will be abducted. The grown ups have 24 hours to choose a child. Would you like to act the 12 year old in the play (the only 'visible' child on stage)? Obviously, in this day and age, her play is not subsidized. It's not about friendly foreigners or religious virtues (such as marriage), that's why.

Hello, my cousin got married the same woman for twice. And now it`s broken again. I hope, there is no connection with the genes of my family. Maybe he should go to a mental hospital. The best is: one of his daugthers is studdying psychology, perhaps she can helps him.

I've attended one marriage once. I didn't like it. I wasn't aware of the fact that you have to buy new clothes to be there. And they may not be white. What ever.
Marriage is like sex, just a stoopid way of proving your love.

Many friends of mine have been bachelors for a long time and didn't like that. I am not religous and my opinion is that everybody should make their own free choices. I just believe in love.

Correction: extraterristRials. Sorry.

ET

Susann, I think marrying twice with the same person is very romantic.
The experience I had with a student psychology is a little bit traumatic, so if I was your cousin I would opt for the mental hospital instead.
Jan Thys, am I missing something here? Is 'extraterrestrial' some kind of code? Because I don't think ET is very sexy. And I also don't like kinky sex that much.

Weddings

I am sorry Arnon, but I disagree with you. I like weddings. They are very romantic. Some friends of mine don't like weddings, but they are cynical, jealous or both. You have to be in love once in your life to understand what it is like. Then you understand why people get married and spend a lot of money on it.

Amita

I just believe in love is a non sequitur.
I just believe in pancakes for that matter, blueberry pancakes. A rather flippant comment I agree.
But stating that you just believe in love is once again a meaningless statement. And now Amita could you please answer my questions.

Aisha

Once again I don’t mind that you like weddings. I don’t mind that you think weddings are romantic. Some people like to smoke pot -- other people prefer to eat smoked salmon. As long as they don’t bother me, it’s fine.
Don’t come to me with this crap that you have to be in love to understand it. There is nothing more cynical than the wedding industry, I mean organized religion is so obvious cynical.
You are entitled to love weddings as you are entitled to love anal sex, but don’t start telling me that love has anything to do with the wedding industry. This is just sheer ignorance or bad taste. To believe in glamour, which is the foundation of the wedding industry is both a sign of ignorance and bad taste. No need to be ashamed -- we all suffer from bad taste from time to time. But don’t be a zealot, please.
Are you married? If not, send your picture to Johannes. (Johannes@arnongrunberg.com) Also state your monthly income after taxes.
If you are married please send a picture of you and your significant other to Johannes.
Thanks!

Johannes

Kinky sex with extraterrestrials is simply not possible. The extraterrestrial prefers the missionary position. Oral sex is extremely dangerous for the extraterrestrial. Thousands of extraterrestrials have already died because of humans forcing the extraterrestrial to have oral sex. Before and after sex the extraterrestrial must drink lots of water. Sex in sunlight can cause the extraterrestrial to loose consciousness. Condoms are extremely dangerous for the extraterrestrial as well. Many extraterrestrials have left their human partner with a skin disease because of the use of a condom. This skin disease cannot be cured as of today.
Johannes it’s an unpleasant surprise to me that you seemed not to be aware of all this.

Question ?

Arnon, I have read your comments carefully, but you haven't asked me a question.

Amita

I quote:
"Amita, please send your picture to Johannes (Johannes@arnongrunberg.com.) Inform him what’s your monthly income after taxes, if you have ever been arrested, if you have ever been or still are patient in a mental hospital. and if you play tennis and/or golf. Please add some information about cooking skills. With your picture and this information we will look for your future husband and we will find him. "
If you are not willing or able to answer these questions fine. But please stop being a lying Amita. Outside marriage it's a good thing to be honest.

Surprise

Arnon, actually it's no surpise to me that you are an expert on how to fuck extraterrestrials.

At the end of 'Endless Cycle', Lou Reed sings:
The truth is they're happier when they're in pain
In fact, that's why they got married

Arnon

I am not lying. You can watch my site on hyves where you can find my picture and lots of details about me (except for my income). You accepted me as one of your "hyves" friends actually.

Regarding the questions, I assumed that your question was in the case that I was not married. On the 4th of April I revealed on this site that I am married to Herman.

Amita

Amita, all I can say is God bless you.
I apologize for asking information about your monthly income after taxes. Just tell me what’s on your savings account, approximately, if it’s less than ten thousand euro my assistant Johannes will send you hundred euro right away.
I never accepted anybody as my friend.
Where can I find pictures of Herman?
Could you please send pictures of Herman to Johannes?
I have an acquaintance and he’s collecting pictures of men named Herman. This acquaintance is rather sick -- we would be grateful for this small gift. I’m sure a picture of your Herman will cheer him up. And isn’t this why you are still on this world Amita, to give love to poor and sick people? In case your Herman is poor and sick too Johannes will send him reading material and twenty euro on a regular basis.
Johannes could you please confirm this.

Arnon: for me, your fan of the first hour: could you put away your anger and throw in a sprinkle of charm? Personally, aggression depresses me even more than ignorance does. And tomorrow morning I really need to wake up to something inspiring in this ignorant and aggressive world.

Tess

You see anger where at best there’s the smell of sarcasm, and you notice aggression where a young man is trying to engage a happily married woman and her husband in a serious discussion about love and responsibility. If you think that offering some money to Mr. and Mrs. Hartman is an act of aggression all I can say is: with fans like you I don’t need enemies anymore.
Which is not to say that I don’t appreciate your comments, your motherly love, the book you sent me -- and the flowers you forgot to send me. All highly appreciated by me and my extended family. My only small request is that in the future, somewhere in the year of 2009, you will make an effort to see that my charm and my sarcasm are connected and cannot and should not be disconnected.
I hope you are going to apologize for your last comment.
If not I’m going to apologize to myself on your behalf.
This is called: being self-sufficient.

Amita

Excuse me for writing Hartman, I believe your name is Hartmann. I apologize sincerely. This was a mistake, I hope not a Freudian slip

Amita, please take Arnon's offer seriously.
He is very keen on supporting married couples, you know. Isn't that romantic?
Jan Thys, Arnon informed me about sex with extraterrestrials. Could you please give me some additional info? And are you still planning to join the mudwrestling event as a transvestite? This week I'm talking with people in Belgium to organize the event, that's why.
Tess, we must make an appointment to have milk & cookies very soon. I'm very worried about you.

(Arnon your comments make me happy)
I am surprised when people invite you to their wedding, tell you what style of new clothes you must wear, that you can't bring your children and have to stay in a hotel on the other side of the country, tell you to sit for hours at a dinnertable next to someone you desperatly need to look for topics to talk about and they tell you that there is a list of expensive gifts they expect the guests to buy for them.
Not for one second they ask you how you feel about it. If you don't do exactly as you are told and fake you enjoy all of this you''ll deeply hurt their feelings and worst of all would spoil their day. After a few years they break up and expect you to be devastated.

Johannes

I would like to point out to you that you don’t FUCK an extraterrestrial.
You make love to the extraterrestrial.
Never ever should you say to an extraterrestrial: “I’d like to fuck you.”
This is considered highly offensive.
All you say is: “Please, take your clothes off.”
The rest as the great poet said is silence.
It’s no coincidence that you hardly see an extraterrestrial in a porn movie.
The extraterrestrial is an extremely discrete and sensitive being. For him (or her) sex is not a meaningless and selfish act as it is for must human beings. For the ET sex is an important form of communication, for the extraterrestrial sex is what we human beings consider a philosophical argument, it is his way of making sense of the world and his body.
Never ever use the F-word in front of an extraterrestrial.

Arnon, your description of extraterrestrial sex sounds like marital sex. Do you have to marry an extraterrestrial first to 'make love' with her/him?

@johannes

We have a different approach to marital love. Why do you think Arnon describes that kind of making love in his last comment?

@johannes

To me it has nothing to do with marital sex in specific.

Hanne, didn't you see the movie Eyes Wide Shut?
The most married people I encounter do not seem to have a very good sex life.
What is martial sex all about in your opinion then?
Arnon, that extraterrestrial you describe sounds frigid.

Johannes

I don’t know what marital sex is. The extraterrestrial does not know the concept of marriage. For him sex is just an extension of talking, having a meaningful conversation.
Of course it is possible while having sex to whisper to the extraterrestrial “you dirty whore” or “you are a perfect slut,” but utter these words in a polite way. And don’t be surprised if the ET feels the need to call you “a dirty whore with no sense of decency,” it is his way of reacting to your outbursts of melancholy. Having sex with the extraterrestrial is like having a seven-course dinner. The extraterrestrial is slow food. He needs to be processed for hours and hours and he needs time to process you. It’s not something you can do more than once every six months, as a human being that is.
Never give the extraterrestrial a cold shoulder after finishing this beautiful dance we call sex, offer him a glass of water, a bottle might be even a better idea. The extraterrestrial is fond of Evian. A grown-up extraterrestrial will drink six to seven bottles of Evian after having sex with a human being. Give him the time to do this, sing a song for him, ask him about his family. After this most extraterrestrials would like to relax in the refrigerator before going back to his or her normal life. Don’t let him ask: “Can I use your refrigerator?”
This is degrading.
After sex invite him to your refrigerator. Say to him: “If you want to use my refrigerator, be my guest.”
These details are very important to the extraterrestrial and his survival on our beautiful planet.

Johannes & Hanne

All I have to say regarding you last comment is that the Dutch minister of culture told me earlier this month that novel The Asylum Seeker was frigid in his eyes. Maybe he meant to say that he thought I was an extraterrestrial.
On a more frivolous note: I really would like to get a definition of marital sex without any reference please to any movie made by Stanley Kubrick.
And Hanne, please limit your comments. I asked you this once before. You can visit this site as often as you want just don’t comment, except on Sunday’s and well I’m a moderate person on Christmas.

Kill your darlings

Good morning Arnon. I've gone from writer's fantasy to writer's enemy, A flawed character. And a bourgeois, irritating, motherly one at that. I suppose I'm a lost case but will continue to read this blog looking for Arnon's Next Top Commentator. Andrea? Oscar?

@Johannes,
1. Your memory is excellent, it makes you a better assistant but a dangerous man as well. Not a good idea to make me perform as a transvestite for peace. People would be horrified and I surely would eat all Tess’ cookies, not to mention what could happen if I see the extraterrestrial in her.
2. I am not a novelist, so I only speak from personal experience. Extraterrestrials are everywhere (like guardian angels or leprechaun). Sometimes you can see them. Again Arnon, as a novelist, is very close to the matter, so I can agree. But beware every encounter is personal. No help from friends or conventional behaviour (like marriage) is available.

Embedded

Arnon, I think marital sex is a bit too safe, too structured on forehand and the danger is that lust will fly away like a flying saucer and the love shortly after. Maybe this is the definition of marital sex by someone who is not married.
Marriage on a social level is a way to structure a society, to prevent chaos.
If I'm ever going to marry I will inform you about it. As your assistant that's the least I can do. If you would like to, you can be embedded with my future wife and me anytime.

Other functions of marriage

It's great to wake up and read a discussion like this on your weblog. Finally some action. I agree with Arnon that marriage is a ritual, but maybe he is too quick in calling it hollow. Many conservative authors see marriage as an institution that is irreplacable - it gives us big connections instead of loose ties with society and family. I don't agree with them, but I think it's too easy to see marriage solely as an hollow ritual.

Personally I enjoyed your sarcasm and don't see the anger and agression other people see. Continue in writing colmuns that lead to discussion.

Marital Sex?

What marital sex? I thought that was a rumor made up by the wedding industry...

My wife and I used the term 'marriage' to make sure most of our friends would come to our party. We had a short ceremony, in part because we arrived late at city hall. Then we celebrated on the beach with an enormous BBQ and disco music.

I guess the most important reason to stay away from getting married is when you feel pressured to use the standard format. I can't see anything wrong with celebrating love.

Tess, Sander and others

Tess, you have never been my darling and if you go on like this I’ll never give you a child. Not even a pet. If you have any bourgeois virtues they might save you. Furthermore I never knew that there were top commentators. But I’m glad you enlightened me.
Sander, nothing wrong with celebrating love, I prefer to celebrate without witnesses but maybe this is a flaw.
My main points are these: the social pressure is on those who are not married. That’s not always fair. And people in general tend to idealize marriage. That’s not always a good idea. For many being married might be a blessing or something close to that, but for many others it is a trap, often a trap they don’t know how to get out of, for economical, practical and emotional reasons.

Arnon: with 'kill your darlings,' I of course meant metaphorically. I feel it's time to kill Tess. She has developed into something quite stale (with a few bourgois virtues or vices, whatever these may be). Then again: characters are supposed to be flawed, right?
On the issue of marriage which is the topic at hand: I feel it's a cruel institution. Especially this whole business of the 'lucky few' who get to be the VIPS of the day.

@johannes

i meant: i do not believe the description of sex with extraterestrials meant bad sex

If I knew there was a top commentator competition, I would never have started commenting in the first place. Please don't.

What I've come to notice: wealthy people most often are good looking people. I don't know which came first. Not the marriage, that's for sure.

@arnon

does an extraterrestrial believe in monogamy?