LIANE HANSEN, host: When Arnon Grunberg was 22 years old, he published his first novel in the Netherlands, his home. "Blue Mondays" was critically acclaimed and Grunberg gained instant fame. But he fled the literary spotlight in Europe for the obscurity of New York City where he waited tables, worked in real estate and wrote his second novel. "Silent Extras," which has just been published here, is the story of three friends who are determined to be famous at any cost. It contains Arnon Grunberg's wry observations about fame, which he did not seek.

Mr. ARNON GRUNBERG (Author): Because everybody warned me not one time but many times, 'Don't expect anything when it comes to sales' or whatever, I never thought about people on the street or in a cafe recognizing me from a television show, anything like that. I was not really prepared for that.

HANSEN: Hmm. Your three characters, Broccoli, who's real name is Michael Eckstein; Elvira and--is it Ewald (pronounced E-VALD). Do I pronounce his name...

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yeah. Ewald (pronounced E-VALT). I would say Ewald.

HANSEN: Ewald. They are truly interested in seeking fame, possibly for fame's sake. You actually write in the book, "Silent Extras," about them, 'We heard Hollywood calling the way other people heard the call of a monastery or of their adulterous neighbor or of big money or God. In the still of the evening, the call meant for us was especially clear. It drove us completely crazy.' What is that about that siren song of Hollywood, in particular, that enthralls these three fictional characters that you've created?

Mr. GRUNBERG: Well, I think Hollywood means for them an escape of their own reality which they experience as a burden. For them, fame is a way to escape from their daily lives, from their parental homes, from their backgrounds. And it's also they really want to be good actors. But the fame part for them is so important because they really want to be respected. They want to be more than silent extras in their own lives that they're not really in control.

HANSEN: Elaborate on the term that you use as the title of the book, 'silent extras.' You talk about the characters being silent extras in their own lives. What does that mean?

Mr. GRUNBERG: They have the feeling that life hasn't started yet; that they have to do something big. They have to accomplish something. And also, that means that they have a feeling that the outside world, that these people don't take them seriously.

HANSEN: What have you learned by failure? We're talking to you as a success, as a successful writer. You're only 30 years old. What have you learned about failure?

Mr. GRUNBERG: Before my first novel, "Blue Mondays," I went through quite a lot of failures. I had to leave high school when I was 16. And then I didn't want to go to another school because I wanted to be an actor. I tried to go to several theater schools and no theater school wanted to accept me. And then I started working for an office. I made photocopies all day long. So after a year, I decided that I had to leave and I started my own publishing house. I went to Frankfurt to the book fair. There I met a woman who started a conversation, and after five minutes she said, 'Are you a publisher?' And I was so--I really liked her and I decided that in order to continue the conversation, I have to say yes.

HANSEN: Ah, so you pretended to be a publisher and then after--to talk to this woman.

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yeah.

HANSEN: And then you decided to had to start a publishing company.

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yes.

HANSEN: You were 21 years old, right?

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yes.

HANSEN: Yeah.

Mr. GRUNBERG: So I went back and she offered me a German novel that I could publish in Dutch translation. And I went to the bookstore, bought books in order to find phone numbers of translators and I published four or five books. And they got quite good reviews but the sales were terrible. And then I went back to the Frankfurt book fair in order to sell the leftovers of my publishing house and I met a publisher from a Dutch publishing house, a much bigger one. He took me to a Chinese restaurant and he asked me all kinds of things about my life. He said, 'Forget the publishing. You should write a novel for my publishing house.'

HANSEN: So "Blue Mondays" is the novel that this publisher basically said--dared you to write the novel, right?

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yes. And then we had an agreement that whenever I had finished a chapter, I could go to the publishing house and he would take me out for lunch, chapter by chapter...

HANSEN: You wrote chapter by chapter...

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yes.

HANSEN: ...lunch by lunch.

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yes, exactly.

HANSEN: Was the second novel easier or different? And why did you write a second one then?

Mr. GRUNBERG: In a way my whole life changed after the first novel. Suddenly I could start writing for several newspapers and magazines. I wanted to go to New York anyway, but I could go there and write a column about life in New York for a newspaper. So I could survive financially. And also, of course, because of this first novel, people were expecting a second novel. And not only that, I discovered that writing is something I really would like to do.

HANSEN: Why was it important for you to come to America and come to New York?

Mr. GRUNBERG: Very simple. My girlfriend was born in Yonkers and she wanted to live in New York. I followed her.

HANSEN: Now wait. So you left fame and fortune in Amsterdam where you'd lived since you were born in 1971 and you moved to New York where I understand that you worked in--What?--real estate and waited tables.

Mr. GRUNBERG: I lived in Queens the first nine months of my life in New York and it was so good to be away from all the publishing parties, from all the attention, from all journalists who ask questions about political stuff, economic stuff. In fact, I remember going every morning to the Dunkin' Donuts to eat my bagel and drink my coffee and there I sat with five older women. And we started talking and one of the women invited me to her apartment for coffee and cake and was--I think, for writer it's very important that he or she is not surrounded all the time by people who know that he or she writes. For a writer, it's important to listen to other people. So many stories I would have missed if I hadn't wait tables in this Italian restaurant in Manhattan.

HANSEN: Is there a story that you've written about that you've incorporated that you can tell us, I mean, from either your waiting days or your days in real estate?

Mr. GRUNBERG: The waiting days, it was a small Italian restaurant. It was with a mother and two daughters. And, of course, there were all the things that happened in the kitchen. We had a busboy and he was always on the edge of getting fired but then he managed to convince the owner, the mother, that--because he was very charming--he was from Bangladesh--he should not be fired. But in a way he could not care less and sometimes he was really--he was starting fights with the clients because also one of the things we had to do was to put cheese on the pasta. I remember one day a client asked for more and more cheese and the busboy said, 'No. You have enough cheese. If you want more cheese, you can go home.' And, of course, we all had to laugh about it because it's such a thing you really cannot say. But these things happened there almost every day.

HANSEN: Great dialogue: 'If you want cheese--more cheese, you have to go home.'

Mr. GRUNBERG: Yes.

HANSEN: I can see how that would be grist for a writer's mill.
I'd like you to read, if you don't mind, just a small piece from your...

Mr. GRUNBERG: No, not at all.

HANSEN: It's Ewald.

Mr. GRUNBERG: It's Ewald, OK.

HANSEN: Yes. And he's describing himself to us as a money grubber. Now before you read the passage, what's the Dutch word for money grubber? Where does this word come from?

Mr. GRUNBERG: It's very funny that you ask me this question because, Liane, this was the first line--I had one of the first lines--the word in Dutch is (Dutch spoken) and I had this line (Dutch spoken), which means, 'I'm a money grubber.' And I thought this was a beautiful line to start a novel with.

HANSEN: Ha.

Mr. GRUNBERG: So this word was really important to me. I came to it because there was, indeed, some person who sent me a fax and who told me that I was a money grubber. So I thought, this is a beautiful word, I will do something with it.
(Reading) 'Someone called me up once and said, "God, you're such a money grubber." It was a movie producer. I thought, "Yeah, that's exactly what I am, a money grubber." "You're right," I said. "You are absolutely right." Later I wrote to him and said, "Nothing inspires me like money. My life motif is my bank account number. My song is a paean to money. And when I want to be sung to sleep, I listen to the exchange rates on the radio. When you think of me, then think a little of money, too. Because when I think of you I think of money as well." I opened a window and screamed out into the streets, "I am the money grubber. The money grubber's back in town." Not that anyone noticed. From 6 in the morning till 8 in the evening, trucks go roaring through my streets and drown out every sound. Even if you hung out a window with a megaphone, no one would hear you.'

HANSEN: I love Broccoli's--your character Broccoli. He also forms what is called the Association of Geniuses.

Mr. GRUNBERG: Uh-huh.

HANSEN: Yeah. He describes himself as a wunderkind who--I'm interested in that word, too, 'wunderkind.'

Mr. GRUNBERG: It's Broccoli's reaction to all the expectations of his parents and of his family. I remember being called a wunderkind myself by an aunt and I always hated it and always--I hated the expectations from the teachers who expected me to be whatever--a lawyer. And so when people have this high expectation of you, you feel that you only can disappoint them, whatever you do.

HANSEN: How ironic that you have actually become a success and people are calling you a wunderkind because of your early success at writing and publishing. Your parents and family must be very proud.

Mr. GRUNBERG: Well, yeah. My father died before my book came out. And my mother--to be honest, at the beginning, she hated my first novel and she could not stand it and she was very angry because, of course, like she thought that people could recognize her, which absolutely was not true. But after a while the neighbors came to her and they said, 'Oh, we saw your son on television. We read the book.' And as soon as the neighbors told her that I was not a failure, she could live with it. And now she's very proud.

HANSEN: Arnon Grunberg. His novel is called "Silent Extras" and it's published by St. Martin's Press, and he joins us from New York.
Thank you very much.

Mr. GRUNBERG: Thank you, Liane.

HANSEN: This is NPR's WEEKEND EDITION. I'm Liane Hansen.