Arnon Grunberg

Mother

Situation

On the technique of interrogation and Sinwar – Ayelett Shani in Haaretz:

‘Interesting distinction. Let's talk a bit more about that. What do you say to him, for example? "I am your dad's age." Sometimes the interrogee himself says that – "You're my dad's age" – and then it's a lot harder for him to be brazen or defiant, to quarrel or be a smart aleck.’ (…)
‘What do you usually do in interrogations? What is your strategy? I try to create a connection with the interrogatee. He will never give you information if he doesn't connect with you – trusts you or "falls in love" with you, as it were. Or even is afraid of you – that's emotion, too. But there has to be some sort of emotional connection. Of course there are all kinds of situations. For example, there's longing for his parents. They talk about that a lot. "I miss my mother. I didn't get to speak with her before I was arrested." A top-ranking Hamas person whom I interrogated recently wanted each time to only talk about his mother, who doesn't know where he is. So I go with that, connect with him.
Are you authentic in interrogations? Completely. I say true things and insert a few other details.
What, for example? I tell him all kinds of supposedly real things about myself. He feels that I am revealing myself to him.’

(…)

‘f someone who knows you well were sitting with you in the room while you conduct an interrogation, would he see a different personality or someone who's familiar to him? There is a lot of play-acting, but I am still me. For example, one time I was with an interrogee when my sister called to tell me that our mother had been hospitalized. The interrogee asked, in Arabic, what the conversation had been about. I told him that my mother was in the hospital. So he said, "I wish her good health." After a few hours they decided to discharge my mother. I didn't hold back but went over to him – I wanted to create a personal connection. I told him, "Look, you said 'I wish her good health,' and God heard you and she was discharged." He was happy. I wasn't lying. I only flattered him a little, talking about how excited I was that he had wished her well, and that it had helped her.’

(…)

‘And you are able to stay with the person-inside-them even when they relate horror stories about their actions? Yes. Now, for example, I have been interrogating the same Hamas person for more than a week. I've extracted a few big intelligence reports from him, mountains of information, because of the affinity forged between us. He's already asking to sit with me. I also plant hope in him – he asks me all the time if there will be an exchange of prisoners [for Israeli hostages]. He fantasizes that he will be returned [to Gaza], he asks me to check online about what's going on. I reply that in time there will certainly be prisoner exchanges. I realize that this is what he's holding onto, so why not say it? It's also not a total lie.
No. Not that I mind lying to him. But it's dangerous. If you lie to him and he finds out that you lied, the situation is lost, you've also lost him.’

(…)

‘You were impressed by his intelligence.
Yes. He is super-intelligent. And also educated."
That's unusual in the landscape of Shin Bet interrogatees? Yes. Very. All the top Hamas figures involved in the organization at the beginning were unusual. Doctors. Engineers. Students.
I read a paper by journalist Shlomi Eldar that dealt in part with a security prisoner who was the first to talk about the importance of acquiring education in Israeli prisons, in the 1960s. He said something like: With the ignoramuses and rabble of Gaza it will be impossible to defeat the Zionist enemy. Learning is essential. Education is essential.
That's it exactly. The entire senior leadership of Hamas at that time had studied at the Islamic University.’

(…)

‘And what fearlessness. Micha Kobi noted also that Sinwar often made threats in his interrogations.
He has no fear. He did not hide his thoughts about his intention to murder Shin Bet personnel. He told me, "I will murder you, all your colleagues in the Mukhabarat [Arabic for secret police]," as he termed the Shin Bet. You need to understand what level of psychological warfare he employed already then, as a detainee. He faces you and curses and threatens, and is not afraid. I don't know how that served him. Why should someone under interrogation do something like that? Even if that's what you think, what do you gain from telling the interrogator that you will murder him?’

(…)

‘An interrogation, certainly of a person like this, is a mind game. How would you characterize his game? He tried to play on what is known and what isn't. He told us what he knew that we knew, and was silent about the rest. I believe that the fact that we combined Shehadeh and Yassin as part of our large interrogation circle was the key, because their message to the [other] interrogatees was, "Friends, you took a blow, everyone will tell what he has to tell, and we will go to jail like big boys. We absorbed a minor blow, but we'll win in the next battle."’

(…)

‘You know, I pored over many sources. Everyone who came into contact with Sinwar says things similar to what you said: that he's determined, that he's brilliant, that he's charismatic. The only exception was a comment by Betty Lahat, the Israel Prisons Service officer who was the warden at Hadarim Prison. She said Sinwar was a coward – that he incites and instigates, and then hides.
She apparently missed something. Seriously. Maybe he deliberately let her see a different part of him. I don't want to sound arrogant, heaven forbid, but in the Shin Bet there was a consensus about him as early as 1988. There was agreement that with his abilities and his character, we would hear about him as a leader one day.’

(…)
‘Do you think Israel will succeed in getting to Yahya Sinwar? No, I believe he will manage to escape. If he doesn't succeed in doing that, he will try to make some sort of deal involving the captives, in order to save his skin. Unfortunately, I don't think Israel will get its hands on him.’

Read the article here.

Sinwar as the hyperintelligent, enigmatic yet ruthless leader.
He’s already a myth.
If you read this article you would say that it’s only a matter of time before Netanyahu and Sinwar shake hands. After all, diplomacy is just one of the many strategies to reach your goal.

And it’s clear that for now for both sides militarily there’s only so much you can do.

Hamas had a big victory on October 7.

All Israel could do and is doing is trying to reestablish some deterrent.

Whether the deterrent will work will be clear the comin years, it depends also on the question whether the Israeli government i.e. Netanyahu has any plans for postwar-Gaza.
The answer there is: no.

At best a return to the good old status quo ante.

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